I can understand why governments would push for something like this after 9/11, though it of course goes without saying that this is a totally unacceptable violation of someone’s basic rights. It also goes without saying that governments always want more control over their citizens, but what exactly are they so worried might happen, right now, in 2025 or the near future?
European elites are worried about losing control, and they are responding by restricting freedoms.
The Palestine/Gaza issue is one concrete example: European elites are very pro-Israel and pro-Genocide. But they have completely failed to control the narrative and European populations are not as pro-Israel as their elites.
They might also be getting cocerned about people finding out that elites routine participate in sexual abuse of children.
I don’t see how any regime can maintain legitimacy if normies finally grasp the scope of the issue.
They are prepping to rule by force, fuck your consent.
They will rape children and jack shit you can do about it.
Gaza
Does Israel have that much sway over Europe? The Germans are perhaps still motivated by guilt over the Holocaust, to the extent that they’re willing to look the other way while another one is being committed. Makes sense, right? 🤦 Pure insanity.
70 years of propaganda has its roots deep in generational beliefs that any criticism of Israel’s actions as a nation state could only be rooted in their ethnicity and religion and therefore must be countered.
No one wants to criticize privacy-invading “think of the children” laws for fear of being seen as a pedo or pedo-enabler, and likewise no one wants to stand up against Israel for fear of being seen as a Jew-hating antisemite.
I see the parallels, but is it really causal? I feel like this was going to happen given the state of net neutrality in general with or without Gaza.
In terms of “why?” it’s not causal on its own, but in terms “why now?” I believe it is. It’s the two-by-four that broke the camel’s back.
That’s a good point. I’ve been thinking of it as a natural progression of the anti net neutrality/“protect the children” pushes we’ve been seeing in the states. Tbh I thought it seemed more in character for a government like the UK.
it was always going to happen eventually, but the situation with gaza lit a fire under its urgency and you can see it happening for yourself as the west is capturing moderation on all centralizated social media platforms via appointing of idf & isreali officials/officers.
Removed by mod
Please don’t tarnish your quality comments with ableist slurs so I won’t have to regret needing to remove them.
It’s partly because of the guit of holocaust, but also because they just don’t personally want to lift a finger regarding Palestine. It’s a toxic mixture of inbred zionism, cold geopolitical calculus, appeasing the US in trying time in transatlantic relations, and neocon hubris. They maybe can bend to appease their own populations, but they really are not prepared to stop Israel and they would much rather help them. They just want the genocide to happen, but quietly and out of sight and no protests.
But it’s not really just Gaza. They do this because of Ukraine, rising cost of living, European humiliation in from of Trump, falling economy, their own unpopularity, etc… They are fearing the upheaval and people getting ideas when Brussels doesn’t seem to have any of it’s own. Remember that these are the same people who though that the end of the soviet union was the end of history and they are the culmination of humanity. They cannon accept being wrong or stepping down at this point.
It’s the frustration of European elites who realized that they can’t control the narrative anymore. Gaza is one prominent example, but not the only one.
Does Israel have that much sway over Europe?
It’s not so much that Isreal does, but for all intents and purposes Israel = America. It’s our colonial outpost in the Middle East, an “unsinkable aircraft carrier”, and as Joe Biden said, “if Isreal didn’t exist, we would have to invent it”. And as much as Europeans don’t want to believe it, most European countries are American vassal states. Look at the pictures of all of your leaders gravelling at Trump’s feet and literally calling him “Daddy”.
Gaza is only the beginning. They are also preparing for mass unrest at home as standards of living worsen. Just this week the German chancellor said Germany “can no longer afford the welfare state”, meanwhile they are spending record amounts on arms. They are preparing for millions of climate refugees at their borders.
You should expect and prepare for a lot more Gazas all over the world in the future. Your leaders are.
It’s due to Palantir and co, lobbying various European governments in recent years. Look at which EU governments are Palantir’s clients.
It’s sadly led to the EU has actually announced a copy of the UK Online Safety Act for 2026, as far as I can tell: https://leminal.space/post/25089051/17854998 It’s received less press coverage than the whole Chat Control thing.
Peter Theil is the #1 most dangerous man in the world right now. Need Luigi #2.
it looks like they’re just realizing that they can push it this far and people won’t really fight back about it
Totalitarianism.
People outside Europe doesn’t understand how our governments are speed running getting a totalitarian government. More and more aspects of anyone’s everyday life are getting controlled everyday.
Here they are already starting a system of garbage bags with nfc tags to have our garbage controlled.
At the end of the day they are thirsty for power and control.
Here they are already starting a system of garbage bags with nfc tags to have our garbage controlled.
Sounds like a great way of getting people to throw their garbage in any place other than the bag…
Which country is it?
Spain. They have started in some regions. And they are aiming for a national implementation in a few years.
🫂
Falls somewhere between people not being cool with genocide and greed.
Because there’s a surge of fascism and they think they can get it
EU is fasttracking the Fourth Reich. Can’t have totaliarism without complete communication control.
I do think it’s Gaza. For decades until the last couple of years, the plight of Palestinians have been mostly ignored. The whole of Europe and algosphere in the middle east have had active or passive public approval for middle east policy for the past century. Vietnam war reporting soured the public on far east colonialism and war reporting went softball afterwards and that softball unraveled in the 2010s and now Gaza is the modern day Vietnam war for reporting on disregard for life from pretty much ourselves. Israel is an ally of our countries.
So now government policy is incredibly misaligned with public opinion now and what was a steady grind at enacting internet control is suddenly a mad rush for governments. Israel is a line in the sand for the powerful like Vietnam was in the 60/70s was for media control/influence
I think there are two discrete forces at work pushing in the same direction here. The Jewish supremacist EU states want to spy on all communications because of Gaza, but the push for age verification is more that ad companies fund everything in the West and ads sell for WAY more if they know exactly who you are (this was Facebook’s major advantage in an internet that was largely pseudonymous at the time). Age gating the images of warcrimes and making those who see them register that they’ve seen the images to see them is just a side benefit.
Centralization tends be self-reinforcing. Social unrest might cause the public to demand more safety measures, which usually come at the expense of freedoms. I’d also wager that the lower the level of trust in government is, the more they want to impose control and authority.
And in the EU specifically it is because lobbyists have been working overtime to try and pass chat control: https://borncity.com/win/2023/09/27/european-union-which-lobby-organizations-are-behind-the-plans-for-chat-control/
If you didn’t know, it seems like the EU has actually announced a copy of the UK Online Safety Act for 2026 too, as far as I can tell: https://leminal.space/post/25089051/17854998
For those here who didn’t know specifics, as far as I know the EU has announced in July 2025 guidelines, set to come into effect until 2026, that seem to basically be the same as the UK online safety act:
https://ec.europa.eu/newsroom/dae/redirection/document/118226
These guidelines say, among other things, check the last link: “Where the provider of the online platform has identified medium risks to minors on their platform as established in its risk review […] and those risks cannot be mitigated by less restrictive measures. The Commission considers this will be the case where the risk is not high enough to require access restriction based on age verification but not low enough that it would be appropriate to not have any access restriction […]” And “Self-declaration is not considered to be an appropriate age-assurance measure as further explained below.”
If you don’t want the Online Safety Act in the EU, call or e-mail your representative now. If you enter your country here, it shows a list: https://fightchatcontrol.eu/#delegates As far as I can tell, unless it’s reversed this will be coming soon. The clock is ticking.
My representatives don’t care. They want it. They are the ones thirsty for power. The only solution is to completely remove them from power. Any letter sent to them is nothing more than toilet paper for these people.
Still worth reminding them some of us will vote them out unless they walk this age check nonsense back. If thousands of people do so, it can be relevant.
Authoritarianism
We are realistically looking at losing between 200 million and 1 billion people over the next 20 years due to climate-change induced famine and heat stroke. Those are realistic estimates. More optimistic scenarios could make that number less, more pessimistic ones could reduce it. We are on the eve of what future histories may refer to as the Great Hunger.
Even for those lucky enough to not live in regions being rendered uninhabitable, the quality of life for the average citizen is collapsing. The developing world will experience mass famine. The developed world will experience food prices not seen since the advent of mechanized agriculture. Home prices will continue to become more unaffordable, as more and more homes are destroyed by rapidly increasing natural disasters. In the US, tens of millions of homeowners are going to have their primary asset, their homes, rendered completely worthless after they become uninsurable. Governments can try to prop up the insurance market if they want, but not even national governments have the resources to subsidize an insurance market in an era of spiraling natural catastrophes.
Leaders around the world see a future of chaos, famine, and strife. Really all the Four Horseman are coming out. In developed countries, leaders fear millions of desperate poor people from developing countries trying to cross their borders. Internally, they fear violence by their own populations, who are seeing their standard of living rapidly collapse.
The borders are being locked down. The walls are going up. People everywhere are being increasingly surveilled and controlled. Political leaders might be cynical enough to deny climate change for political gain, but that doesn’t mean they’re ignorant to the actual future we’re running headfirst into. Technology is also advancing, allowing “mass shooter” type individuals to potentially cause much larger acts of destruction in the future.
Most governments would prefer to maintain power by actually improving the lives of their citizens. That’s the safest and most moral approach. But in a world of rapidly spiraling climate change, governments simply are not capable of on improving the lives of their citizens. They can’t even maintain the standard of living their citizens already have. So, the leaders have to turn to more brute force methods to retain control. Best to be loved. But if you can’t be loved, then at least be feared.
Who’s “we”?
https://www.un.org/en/global-issues/population
“The world’s population is projected to continue growing for the next 50 to 60 years, peaking at approximately 10.3 billion by the mid-2080.[sic]”
Those projections assume agricultural yields have no effect on human well being or numbers. They don’t factor in climate induced bread basket collapse.
Oh I don’t dispute that we can only reach and sustain such vastly inflated populations without significant fossil fuel inputs, I just want to know your source. Are you implying the UN forgot to take agriculture into account?
Yes. That’s exactly it. They assume business as usual. And your source is a landing page, not an actual source. And even then, that site doesn’t discuss any effect of climate change on population projections. You just blindly linked to the UN’s population agency.
For every degree of Celsius warming, farm yields of major staple crops decline 16-20%. We’re already at 1.5C warming, and the rate of warming is rapidly increasing. We’re looking at another 0.5-1.5C increase by 2050. There’s no way this doesn’t lead to mass famine on a Biblical scale.
This paper in Nature predict 4-14% in total global food production by 2050 due to climate effects. And these are using the RPC models, which we’re learning are far too conservative in their predictions. I’m sure if everyone in the world went vegan tomorrow, we could absorb a 10% decline in agricultural production, but not a chance in Hell of that happening.
As far as the UN, they do work on climate change, but their population projections don’t factor it into account. Here is a link to the 2024 population prospects summary
When you pull open that PDF, you won’t find mention of climate change being incorporated into their methodology at all. As far as I’m aware, the UN’s figures are purely based on population pyramids, demographic factors, birth rate projections, etc. Demographers don’t like looking at factors beyond just population numbers, gender mixes, and age distributions. Other things, like war and economic policy, can certainly affect population numbers, but those are generally considered too unpredictable to properly model. The population projections you see are purely demographic models.
As far as I know, agricultural yields are never even part of their methodology. They look purely at what ages people are and how many children people of different ages have. They generally assume that resources will be available for those who want to have children. Do you have any evidence that they do take climate effects on agricultural yields into account when making their numbers?
Good, we can’t sustain even the 8 billion useless eaters we have now. I welcome a decline to 4.
A decline by means of heightened education, better quality of life and available contraception like we see in developed countries would be nice. But this is going to be nasty, famine and wars - you don’t want that, no one wants that.
I don’t want to be fat and old, and yet…
It’s a coordinated play, that’s why. Their hope and plan is that VPNs become worthless because you’re gonna be VPNing into censored countries anyway. They won’t want anonymity/pseudo-anonymity like we’ve had.
Sharks, it’s like Cayman Islands, but for VPN’s instead of tax fraud. I’m offering a 5% stake and I’ll also let you use it for your tax fraud
This is not solely a european problem, and it’s not new.
A faction of conservatives will scream up and down that they’re protecting the children. Most people will generally side with privacy.
My suspicion is that the end goal is to classify people to target your opponents, even the ones who don’t have much of a platform.
Once you can identify all the anonymous people on the internet and build profiles of all their communications with ML, you can easily generate a list of people who are against your policies and target them. I’m pretty sure you could find other subsets of data linking these people so you can then target them indirectly without too much friendly fire against your supporters.
In the US, One easy target I haven’t seen any actions for is Marijuana. All those medical patients are in a database somewhere. All the debit card transactions in stores are in a database somewhere. It’s still federally illegal and the punishments are nuts if prosecuted. Take your communications list, and the MJ list, target the ones on both and ignore the rest. You get to legally enslave your opponents under the guise of weed.
