If I don’t have a choice to leave or feel irrationally compelled to actually try to debate them 10.

It’s not a choice it’s a fucking curse. I don’t have to think, my mind will eventually start predicting what they say and eventually I want to gut myself because I can think of a hundred things to say and know that it won’t change their fucking minds.

Worse, mind reading is a fallacy. Sure predictions can be pretty accurate, but there’s no way to know for sure if those arguments will play out exactly as I think. But there’s real curse is that just because all the things I can think to say won’t change their mind, that doesn’t mean there isn’t something that will. I might just be too dumb to think of a good argument. So I rot as the conversation happens to me trying to think of anything that could make a difference.

Oh also yeah when they say horrible shit and your mind decides to go “here this is how their victims feel” that’s pretty fucking horrible too.

But if I get up or get upset or react strongly it’ll likely ruin any chance of me changing this person’s mind. Not that that chance existed in the first place.

Anyway, it isn’t difficult to see things from other people’s perspective but let me tell you I much prefer talking to psychopaths than delusional idiots.

I had a roommate who was full blown psychopath (and business major to boot lol) who, once he found out I could see things from his perspective, would debate politics with me in a completely candid manner. I once brought up “so you’d support slavery then?” And he deadass said “if it benefitted me then yes”

Fucked up, but the thing is, he’d listen to my arguments when they were logical. And he wasn’t sadistic, slightly narcissistic, but like he didn’t derive pleasure from other’s pain. Anyway the point is that when you talk to someone who is sane it doesn’t hurt even if they feel no empathy because you can start to understand why they think the way they do and it always feels like you can change their mind, and they don’t feel an active desire to hurt people.

Nazis typically aren’t that. Nazis are typically idiots who can’t face the real sources of pain in their life, so they direct their hatred of their lives and themselves to others. Same with manosphere incels, same with bigots of almost every kind. They want to hurt others, they want to break things, to be mad, because they’re hurt. But you can’t get them to see what they don’t want to see in the first place.

So you just feel bad for them, feel bad for others harmed by people like them, and hate yourself for feeling hatred for them because you get why they are doing it.

It isn’t fun and it’s not even fucking useful because it’s not like you being emotionally stressed out is helping anyone ever and you aren’t changing their minds.

Its a curse to feel irrationally compelled to talk to those who won’t listen because “maybe this time it’ll work” it doesn’t.

Edit: okay clearly I’m not in a very good place mentally right now, but I’m leaving this here. If anyone can relate, here’s some external reinforcement since you’ve likely said it to yourself and it doesn’t work: you do not need to feel compelled to feel bad for others constantly especially if it isn’t galvanizing you to take solid action to help. If your suffering stops you from functioning well enough to help anyone then it’s actually a bad thing to feel that empathy. So let yourself relax.

10 I guess, but just because I can doesn’t mean it’s fun to do all the time. Requires deliberate effort.

Not even sure hateful bigots are the hardest to empathize with. Everyone has hated someone or felt disgust before. That’s sort of an ‘in’ to the mindset.

I have a harder time with people like the Paul brothers or Mr. Beast. People who seem to have desires without beliefs.

I mean I used to have opposite views because I grew up where a lot of that stuff is normalized and I didn’t question it until it was challenged, so I can understand being misinformed, hell I’m still misinformed sometimes. But if they’re not open to having their mind changed, and just want to hurt people, I have very little empathy for that.

One problem with empathizing with others’ viewpoints, truly, is realizing a lot of them have downright evil motivations. So, empathizing should make you despise them.

If I’ve had enough time to wake up and I’m not upset about something else (and I think the only thing that really upsets me by now is a random argument with my wife or my mom), and if I determine you’re not arguing in bad faith but actually being entirely frank, probably a 9 or 10?

IME, evil people are rare, and what you’ll find more often than not is that they’re either slow or just straight up insane, so I can’t just go around being THE antisocial prick when people are simply sharing their mind without consciously trying to be hurtful, misleading or disruptive.

9.5 However, just because I can doesn’t mean I have to. I had discussions with a traditional Nazi, with an antisemite, with Corona deniers, … I’ve studied philosophy which teaches you to take other viewpoints to understand the inconsistencies.

But doing it for a long time is extremely exhausting which is why I refuse to discuss renewable energy with my father; who’s not categorically wrong on that topic but narrow minded and only educates himself as much as needed to believe some convenient half-truths.

Me? Id like to think I’m a 6, I don’t cut family ties over their political opinions but I’m very likely to shut that down with a “I don’t want to speak politics with you”.

I’d say that’s 3 or low 4. I think you need to define the middle stages of this scale more clearly.

10

0 because we dont have to coexist. People should be free to live how they want. Unfortunately we all know that auths cant handle people being free and will always come a knocking.

If only I could leave this planet and leave humanity to the silly little games they play with each other’s lives.

I straight up told my father to drop politics or I’ll go home.

He wasnt thrilled about the ultimatum but he stopped. I got the cold shoulder for the remaining evening. :p

Really depends if the viewpoints involve the oppression of other beings than near zero if not maybe 6.5.

One time I had a conversation with a friend who said they would vote for Trump. We don’t even live in America, I asked him why and he said “well he seems more honest and real.” Other times I try and talk to Zionists, and the genuine hatred for Palestinian people is insane, and intolerable, and they got loud and angry when I made reasonable, good points.

Out of 10, if they don’t get angry and loud, like a 6 on average, if they are just uneducated, like an 8?

By that criteria, 10. Like, if a Nazi wanted to seriously talk with me, I’d be fine with that. Glad, even. The thing is, they don’t usually do a whole lot of thinking or analysing, or they would have stopped being a Nazi pretty quickly.

It’s usually more about psychoanalysis - trying to figure out how their irrationality works. I spend a shit ton of time trying to get inside the head of the people who maintain the world’s problems. So, still 10.

It depends on what those opposing viewpoints are. If they involve actively targeting and harming vulnerable people, I have no space at all for those viewpoints or the people that hold them.

For the other stuff, maybe a 7.

0

I have some family members I haven’t spoken to in probably 6 years cause I can’t stand their beliefs. Life is too short to spend it with people that you don’t like.