Archived article: https://archive.md/HONwC
They’ll release one more update (my guess is whatever release-ready content they’ve already got), then the servers will shut down next Thursday.
“We don’t need player counts to be super huge in order to be successful” is starting to ring hollow.
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If it’s unsustainable for you, release the server and game source code for someone else to host it and patch it. Why waste developers’ time and effort into making of this game?!
Nothing to salvage from that mess of a live-service slop.
What a waste, make all these people spend years of their lives building a whole videogame and then immediately make it impossible for anyone to ever play it again. A company shouldn’t have the right to erase a game from existence, even if it is a bad one.
What’s Highguard?
Whenever a game like this flops it gives me hope. Why? Because this kind of game isn’t something that interests me at all. I keep hoping that these companies are going to learn from getting burned, and switch to a style of game that I like more.
I can’t help but think there’s money in acquiring all these completed assets and coming up with a story based single player game around them.
The creative part is already done! Pop it into a non-GaaS structure and see what happens!
I’d have LOVED to explore the world of Brink and it was set up to be another Assassin’s Creed Assassins vs. Templars vibe… and it all fell apart…
You think the responsible will be made responsible? No they will receive parachutes and bonuses as they swap to the next shorting mafia target
God am I sick of all this games as a service season pass loot box shit.
Honestly, I think gaming is done with new live service offerings.
Live service used to be a way to get a core-complete, feature-limited games in front of players earlier than if they were fully baked. This was actually good for everyone, as player feedback often guided roadmaps and changes. But now everyone expects every new game to be better than Fortnite, Overwatch, etc. on day one. This just won’t ever happen.
Also, the gaming community of today is OBSESSED with popularity numbers (steam concurrents and twitch view count, mostly), and if players don’t see that everyone else is playing a game then they won’t play either. This is fucking dumb, but we are where we are.
And don’t even get me started on gaming news and influencers, who seem like they love to hate. They bitch about being stuck with CoD, then shit on anything that could someday compete with it. It’s baffling.
And yet Helldivers 2 comes out in 2024 and sets the world on fire. Seems to me that gaming is perfectly fine with live service as long as it’s in line with community expectations and not s soulless cash grab.
And don’t even get me started on gaming news and influencers, who seem like they love to hate. They bitch about being stuck with CoD, then shit on anything that could someday compete with it. It’s baffling.
Nothing gets more “engagement” like that. It’s not even isolated to games, any other section of news gets the same treatment. It’s a shit show of journalism that we have today.
And don’t even get me started on gaming news and influencers, who seem like they love to hate.
Literally every gaming news media outlet and “influencer” when the topic is Xbox:
Hey… At least it lasted longer than Concord. 🤷♂️
I do feel slightly bad for the dev team. A lotta stuff outside their control spun things out of hand; but I also don’t think it would have had any success regardless of the whole situation. At least what happened got it some attention and gave it a chance.
By “dev team”, I’m guessing you mean the artists, designers, programmers, and testers; the people who spent the last five or so years actually creating the game. Yes, it sucks for them. Their years of work have effectively been thrown in the trash because of Wildlight’s management. I hope they find better work soon, and I hope the management become personae non gratae in the industry.
Honestly it’s the same thing with Concord, and it’s part of why it sucks to hear a lot of shit talk toward the devs of these games. Anyone who’s actually tried either game could tell the dev teams really did put their all into it and wanted to make something interesting and fun, but you can feel the c-suite decisions and live service bullshit weighing them down. Like if the game isn’t an instant hit, it gets shut down, and all that work thrown away. It really fucking sucks for the folks who actually put the work in.
I feel like the exact same thing’s gonna happen with Marathon too. Playtest this week was met with pretty mixed results, people either loved it or hated it. The actual devs are incredible, and having spent far too much time with D2 before dropping it, I’ve gotten to know a few folks on the team and can really vouch for them. But I can’t vouch for their management whatsoever, and they’re the reason I dropped that game entirely and will never touch another Bungie game. I have zero faith in Bungie management keeping this one alive.
Playtest this week was met with pretty mixed results, people either loved it or hated it.
Honestly, that shouldn’t be bad. Not all games need to appeal to everybody. Take ARMA, for example. It would do shit on a playtest, but the group who likes it does it for some of the reasons the rest would hate it. I think we need to switch a bit from “fuck this game, it’s not for me” to “I don’t care about it, it’s not for me. If it’s for you that’s fine”
Oh absolutely, but we know what happens with mixed feedback in this industry today
They already took their millions in Tencent money and ran with it.
It was also free, unlike Concord.
Even if Concord was free, it still would have had less players than Highguard. Nobody wanted to play Concord, at least some people wanted to play Highguard.
- adds account level progression and skill trees
- game shuts down forever in a week
🤦
That’s crazy. I guess it’s good practice to never pick up live service games because you’ll be rolling the dice. I’m glad I pretty much play single player games exclusively.
All live service games will end eventually but a two month run is ridiculous, hahaha.
That’s becoming my takeaway here as well. Don’t jump into any live service game early, because it might get rug-pulled right as I’m getting into it.
Of course, if everyone took this approach then no live service game will ever take off, which kinda feels like where we are anyways.
I genuinely wouldn‘t say so. The game shuts down because nobody played it anyway. The chances you pick up a game no one plays is pretty slim by nature. But even if you have been burned in the past you can just pick up one that is already popular.
Pre-ordering on the other hand is rarely a good idea and that goes for any game, not just live service.
Every live service shuts down because not enough people were playing, eventually. Even ones I loved. I’ve got multiplayer games from 25 years ago that I can still play, but I can’t still play the ones from 10 years ago.
On one hand developers should always give players a way to play their games indefinitely. That should be a basic consumer right and I hope Stop Killing Games can change something.
But on the other hand I would lie if I said I‘d actually use it. I never had the desire to hop into a dead online game out of curiosity and I think at least 99.9% of players feel the same way. Because what makes these games great is the active community.
These things came and went after popularity faded. They need people to stay invested to legitimize their own existence. Pure nostalgia is not enough to preserve games even if developers release the server code. It‘s simply not that easy. I think it‘s important to be aware that communities make online games great and when there is no community then there is no game.
Highguard could release their server code tomorrow, but more people would mock them for it than applaud them. Virtually nobody would play it still.
Virtually nobody is still not nobody. Being able to continue to play it is important not just as a failed piece of art that we can all learn from but also as something that gives it value in the first place. We had the ability to spend money in Highguard, but the value I might get out of that spend depends on the game’s continued existence. If that existence is guaranteed in some way, then I no longer have that barrier. Every live service game has this conundrum, which might explain why they either immediately die or become the next big thing, with very little in between.
Well they could release the server software before shutting down the service, they wouldn’t lose anything.
And have one more competing product if they ever decide to try again? How dare you! :D
disclaimer: I know nothing about the game, the studio, or their future plans, I’m just pulling stuff out of my ass
They’d still have to patch out their anti-cheat. And I’m guessing neither of those things are going to happen.
Considering that this was just a PvP, you’re not losing much in picking it up as long as you don’t spend money on it. It was kinda cool to try it out for one game and realise it wasn’t ever gonna be my cup of tea.
Marathon next? Place your bets ladies and gentlemen!
Marathon is probably life or death for Bungie. Sony can’t exactly afford to put out a mid game after spending so much on the studio… and “mid” is exactly what Marathon felt like. Just like so many copycats during the battle royale boom.
I don’t think it will fail (or if it does, not as hard as Highguard), but unless it manages to stand out from the Tarkov/Arc Raiders/Hunt: Showdown oligopoly, it won’t bring in the numbers to please Sony.
To be honest at this point toppling Embark Studios is pretty tough in my book. The games they make have the same feeling of passion that Bungie used to have. Great gun play, fantastic audio design and interesting ideas. I really hope for the best for Marathon, if for no other reason than competition drives creativity, but Bungie has had the soul sucked out of them unfortunately.
Marathon seems pretty good imo, it’s problem is it’s trying to be a more hardcore extraction shooter than the ones that already exist which is gonna make it too niche to sustain a large US-based studio like Bungie.
Idk I played the play test and it was easily one of the better extraction shooters. Bungie has gun play locked in. But they shot themselves in the foot with BattlEye linux support and my new linux build is literally being put together this week. So regardless, I won’t be buying it when it launches cause it wont run on linux.
post build specs please
Case: O11 Compact Board: MSI 870e Edge TI Wifi
CPU: Ryzen 9 9950 x3D
GPU: XFX RX 9070 xt
PSU: Lian Li EG1000G
Cooler: Lian Li Hydroshift 2 LCDIt took me over a year to get it all together and all of the expensive components were gifts
What’s your RAM situation looking like?
32 gbs. Caught at the first sign of upturn on the RAM crisis.
Edit: 32 DDR5
Mid is exactly how I have seen Marathon described by the server slam feedback. People vasalating between whether or not they like it immediately after starting to play it is not a great look.
I heard the most recent playtest brought some hype back. Did you play it?
People who enjoy hardcore pvp and extraction shooters are hyped… but the important question is whether or not those people represent a large enough niche to sustain a game with such a massive budget.
I’m guessing no, but who knows.
Not a lot, just enough to get the feel of the game, but also to realize that I’m not the target audience. In some ways, it’s similar to Counter-Strike 1.6 or Team Fortress 2 back in high school: if I have a group of friends and an hour of free time, then sure, I might hop on. But I won’t be investing the time and long-term effort that an extraction shooter expects of me.
The moment to moment experience is good. Bungie haven’t forgotten how to create a tight FPS experience. But the game needs both longevity and a healthy playerbase, that’s what concerns me. Fans of hardcore extraction shooters already have Tarkov and Hunt, and casual players already have Arc Raiders. It takes something exceptional to move players out of their “home” game.
Marathon is the complete opposite of ARC Raiders in the fact that it essentially forces/encourages you to fight. I give it like 2 months before all the casuals go back to ARC because of spawn rushers (they were already doing that during the server slam).
Given how boring it is to watch others play it, I don’t think it will see any huge success. It will probably find a loyal fanbase, but probably not enough to sustain it long term.
DOA is my guess but they’ll probably prop it up for a month or so.
I must have been under a rock. This is my fist time hearing about this game. I guess I have a week to check it out and hopefully not like it.
It’s a PvP hero shooter + siege + looter + capture the flag + demolition all in one game, if that’s your alley.
High risk, high reward. At least 2 million players tried the game and said, “No thanks.”
Real indie studios would kill to get those player numbers.
If those numbers weren’t fudged. Steam only had 97k peak players. Usually those numbers are doubled on console. Not 2000% more.
Peak players is sampled at a point, the 2m number is probably cumulative.
Are games like this grifts?
Build hype, get whatever cash you can, and then shut them down?
No, it’s a flop.
It’s hard to believe that a company would spend hundreds of millions to develop a game, only for it to flop. But, that’s how it works with live-service PVP only games. They depend on network effects. People want to play what their friends are playing. If a company gets this right they can be like Minecraft or Fortnite and it’s the game everyone plays, bringing in billions of dollars. If they miss, it can be a complete flop that nobody plays.
I don’t see how this would be a grift. Tencent’s funding seems to have been contingent on some kind of metric, and they pulled out because Highguard fell short.
From some interviews, it sounds like it was just an ambitious mess that didn’t have good testers. IIRC, they said something about everyone pitching 5 ideas every day, and added a couple each time. And it really shows, it is some kind of franken-monster that combines all kinds of ideas that make a patchwork of meh. And then the testers they had either all worked on the game, or were friends with those that did, and nobody wanted to be a downer so they always gave positive feedback.
That’s just the marketing cycle.
Is marketing a grift? I mean, kinda. But you’ll get marketing on good games and bad alike.
Nobody seemed to mind the endless marketing for Expedition 33 or Eldin Ring or Stardew Valley or Minecraft.
It didn‘t sell so no, it‘s not simply a grift. It’s just that nobody wanted it.
Google says they started development in 2022. I’m guessing Overwatch 2 going FTP in January of that year made it seem like the genre was growing instead of trending sideways.
The hubris lol… Oh the hubris!
“Who needs beta testing or early access, we made Anthem, this will be brilliant! Who needs a staff, we can run it with the bare minimum.”
Feel sad for all the devs who already lost their jobs a few weeks back n now these last few left but fuck that company! Thought they could simply profit off all the work from their staff by sacking them all immediately after release.
Sometimes companies do get exactly what they deserve.
build…a player base? should it be expected on day 1? idk
